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#FuturesTrades July 18th Friday 2008 Trade Log

Russell 2000 Emini ER2 Futures

Today	Month	Year
+0.00	+156.00	+2042.60
$0	$15,600	$204,260

Not Applicable

(on vacation)

No Trades (on vacation)

click on image to view actual size

Current Performance Record

Supply/Demand Change of the Day

Profit/Loss Statement

Trade Posting Chat Log Info: My name is M.A. Perry (a.k.a. online as NihabaAshi - martial arts & Japanese Candlestick term) and I am the moderator of #FuturesTrades.

I use the below chat log as feedback to critical trading information that's not available when I review my broker statements nor any statistical analysis of my trading. Also, the above profit/loss info represents my trades only and all trades were posted in real-time within 5 seconds unless otherwise noted after entry or exit as shown in the below chat log.

Further, although I'm not familiar with the trade methods used by most members of #FuturesTrades, I use a rule based methodology (very objective) that involves price action only trading (no indicators).

There is some subjectivity involved with some of my trades when I'm developing a new entry signal, developing new trade management (hence the name TheStrategyLab.com) or when market conditions change resulting in me relying more on my market experience (intuition) instead of on my trading plan.

With that said, today's trade posting chat log is below and it contains all my trades that were posted in real-time along with the trades of other members of #FuturesTrades...

If you want the instructions for gaining access to our free #FuturesTrades chat room...click here.

#FuturesTrades purpose, benefits and access info for day traders, swing traders and position traders...click here.

Time Zone Info Chat Log below is eastern standard time (est) - New York City, U.S.A and/or Montréal, Canada time zone.

WRB Analysis

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Session Start: Fri Jul 18 05:44:29 2008Session Ident: #futurestrades

* Now talking in #futurestrades 05:44

<@X> [NihabaAshi] #FuturesTrades info @ http://www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTra desChatRoom.htm and trade log archives @ http://www.thestrategylab.com/RecentTrad es.htm

#FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm 07:16

<DJ> gm 08:07

<tzar3> gm 08:12

<+DJ> gm

* tzar3 is now known as tzar

<rickf> gm 08:17

<+DJ> gm

<+tzar> gm kn 08:28

<KN-SR> gm tzar 08:32

<+DJ> gm all

<+KN-SR> gm 08:33

<+DJ> (C)

strange price action 08:52

both er and es jumped

on news?

i'm not aware

<+tzar> no

<+DJ> hmmmm

<+tzar> kn gently tapped the up arrow on his keyboard

<+DJ> gotta be it 08:53

<+KN-SR> not asking much :) 08:58

just 75

<+DJ> man!

<+KN-SR> we came all the way 1200 to 1262 ------------ now the few last points :) 08:59

<Widgetman> ya gona short after we hit 75 KN ? 09:01

<+KN-SR> nop

not now

<+Widgetman> yea 09:02

<+KN-SR> we will have some strange price actions

<+Widgetman> seems like all is well

<+KN-SR> willl short at 1292

<+DJ> ty

now we got something to chew on(y)

<+KN-SR> :)

<+DJ> if er breaks 701, could run to 709 and stall then I would look at a short 09:03

kinda ranging now

i want to short today if poss

after a quick scalp higher

<ItalianSharp> morning all 09:11

<+DJ> gm

<ripsboy> gm all... 09:17

<+DJ> gm

<@X> #FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm 09:19

<Trader> 1275 was hit many times since January 09:20

<PapaJon> gm all 09:22

<+DJ> gm

<+Trader> gm

<+PapaJon> Anyone know what caused the sudden rise at 6:30est?

<drt> gm 09:23

<+Widgetman> expiry games papa 09:24

<+PapaJon> hmmf... seems a bit early for that 09:25

<pdays> What time does crude open? maybe was it 09:26

<+DJ> gas was reported

<+ItalianSharp> papa, citigroup earnings better thane estimates 09:28

<+PapaJon> yah.. saw that...

<+DJ> ty

<+ItalianSharp> citigroup earnings report was the only thing on my agenda for today 09:29

it's gonna be a tug of war between citi's earnings vs google's earnings

financials vs techs

<+PapaJon> i think right now.... financials are the worry of the world 09:30

<+DJ> bush said everything is fine(sw)

<+PapaJon> understandably so

<PapaJon> i think right now.... financials are the worry of the world[06:30] <PapaJon> understandably so 09:31

<+DJ> crude at 130

<anglo> gm ladies and gents. 09:33

<+rickf> gm

<+DJ> gm

<+KN-SR> Long ES @ 1257 09:36

aout 56.50 - .50 09:37

<szubaark> Buys ES @ 1256 «« paper »»

<+KN-SR> Long ES @ 1556.25

s.l 1.25

early entry... not looking good 09:38

Exited 1/2 ES Long @ 1257.25 --> - 299 09:39

humm

Long ES @ 1256.25

Exited 1/2 ES Long @ 1257.25 --> + 1

<+szubaark> exit stop moved to breakeven ES @ 1256 «« paper »»

<+KN-SR> Exited ES Long @ 1256.25 --> 0 09:40

<+szubaark> Exited all Long ES at 1256 --> 0 «« paper »»

<+DJ> vol in decline es

<+KN-SR> Long ES @ 1256.25

<+DJ> looking for a pop

<+KN-SR> s.l 55.25

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1256 «« paper »» 09:41

<+rickf> short es 56 sm sz

1.5 sl

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1254 --> + 2 «« paper »» 09:42

<+DJ> movers are closing shorts, it seems, now 09:43

<+rickf> out 54.75 +1.25

<+DJ> 1252 turning point 09:45

1255.25 vwap es 09:46

<stargazer> Long ES @ 1256 09:48

<+KN-SR> it will go further down 09:49

i guess

<+Widgetman> noooooooooo

hehe

<+stargazer> Exited all ES Long @ 1256.5 --> + 0.5

<+KN-SR> we will have the day bullish :)

too bad i have only 2/3 rhs in hand 09:50

51.75 to confirm down trend 09:51

<+DJ> in and out er 692.80 and 694.70

too fast to report

<+KN-SR> 59.75 for up trend

<+DJ> er head and shoulders, short time frame, choppy 09:52

bbl

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1255.50 «« paper »» 09:53

exit stop moved to breakeven ES @ 1255.50 «« paper »» 09:54

Covered all Short ES at 1253.50 --> + 2 «« paper »» 09:55

<+DJ> 1252.25 pivot

<+rickf> grrr GOOG 10:00

<+DJ> GOOG?

<+rickf> oops sorry - wrong window

talking about google

<+DJ> news? 10:01

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1253.75 «« paper »» 10:02

<+rickf> nah - was grousing about my option spread that i closed

<+DJ> ok

spreads sure can pay

<+rickf> the "better safe than sorry" bit -- thought a 50 point cushion was good enough.

<+DJ> i worked goog calls when it was at $185 to a$310 10:03

<+rickf> it was, and i was on the right side....but closed it just to be safe. left a nice credit on the table

<+DJ> paid my bills:-)

<+rickf> could have spiked 50 against me and i'd be s.ol.

:)

<+szubaark> Expecting Volatility spike soon 10:04

<+DJ> good ole days when it was "cheap" and the options were paying great premiums

ty

i'm watching 1252 area

i'm hoping my long lost brother is looking over my shoulder 10:05

would have been his 53rd birthday today

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1253.75 --> 0 «« paper »»

<+rickf> dj - some of them still do, but earnings releases the day before expiration is scary if you're on the wrong side of the trade -- no time to recover

<+szubaark> Buys ES @ 1255.25 «« paper »» 10:06

CHOP againVolatility spike 10:09

<+DJ> right on szu 10:10

candle formations all over the place

counter signals 10:11

my automated trader is showing buys, shorts over three candle formations on minute chart

<+szubaark> Exited all Long ES at 1255.25 --> 0 «« paper »»

<+DJ> scary

<+szubaark> easily to get shaken out

<+rickf> dj - how do you like autotrading? imho the concept scares me

<+DJ> yes, on tight stops

I don't let it actually trade, just tell me when 10:12

then i decide

<+rickf> ah ok

<+DJ> so, i should say, "signal system"

i would have paid a million in commissions today

the old, 10:13

<+silo> Long ER2 @ 693.70 «« paper »»

<+DJ> "in-out" in-out

no vol there, silo

chop

c'mon breakout!

2nd shoulder of resistance at 693.30 10:14

if it breaks, then maybe a long 10:15

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1256 «« paper »»

exit stop set ES @ 1258 «« paper »» 10:16

<+DJ> it's trying 10:17

694.5 high on minute chart 10:18

upper band of 15 minute range

bbl 10:19

<+silo> Exited all ER2 Long @ 692 --> - 1.7 «« paper »» 10:20

ouch

<+szubaark> CHOP here

exit stop moved to breakeven ES @ 1256 «« paper »» 10:21

<+DJ> low vol chop 10:24

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1254.25 --> + 1.75 «« paper »»

<+rickf> short es 54.25 10:25

1.25 ts 10:26

<+szubaark> ts?

<+rickf> trailing stop

<+silo> Shorts ER2 @ 692.30 «« paper »»

<+rickf> trying something new

out 54.75 -.50 10:27

<+silo> Covered all ER2 Short @ 693.90 --> - 1.6 «« paper »»

* codehead_afk is now known as codehead 10:28

<+rickf> i found that it calms the nerves when there's a ts there and not just my 6-pt fixed 'catastrophic' stop

* subq ---market profile charts--- http://www.charthub.com/chart/search/mpc hart

<+szubaark> rick, your software sets the trailing stop automaticly?

<+rickf> yeah -- for example, i sell @ market, the ts is already configured, so both orders go at once 10:29

or if i dont want a ts, i uncheck the box and it doesn't happen.

<+DJ> rick, where is your stop, if you don't mind? 10:30

<+rickf> i'm emulating KN with a 1.25 trailing stop today

<+DJ> then it adjusts automatically for every 5 ticks?

<+rickf> i'm emulating Niha with a 'catastrophic' stop to cover network problems or black swans

<+DJ> that is smart

<+rickf> DJ - every tick it moves

<+DJ> TS went down recently

server access denied 10:31

scary

693.80 res once again

brb

<+rickf> i had to reboot while in a trade and was terrified - so when i saw niha has a fixed 'oh crap' stop it seemed a prudent thing. 6 points was more than enough to protect against market noise

<+DJ> I signed up for a russell trading advisory 10:32

he had a 4 point target (with Trailing stops at 3 points bottom line loss) 10:33

<+szubaark> Catastraphic Stop is a good idea

<+DJ> learning all the time;-)

trading alone completely is a quiet past time

this forum is great

<+rickf> :)

yep can learn a LOT from folks here 10:35

<+DJ> triple top on er which narrowed just in last 11 minutes 10:37

finger tapping;-) 10:38

brb

<+silo> Shorts ER2 @ 690.80 «« paper »» 10:40

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1254 «« paper »» 10:41

<+silo> ^------ follower

<Baxwill> silo, follow what ? 10:43

<+silo> hehe nevermind

that was just a joke

<+DJ> silo,that was a good shot over the bow as vol spike occurred

i almost shorted there as well

this still may break lower 10:44

<nqcruiser> morning Niha 10:45

<+nqcruiser> how r u

<+DJ> 690 is a pivot

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1257.25 --> - 3.25 «« paper »» 10:46

Buys ES @ 1257.50 «« paper »»

<+rickf> back later- gym time

<+DJ> es nearly 50% retracement from open 10:53

<startrader> nq traded off 62% hard, missed short by 1 tick. 10:54

<+szubaark> Exited all Long ES at 1259.50 --> + 2 «« paper »»

<+Baxwill> DJ u here 11:03

<+DJ> y

gm

<+Baxwill> would u email me if I provide address, re Icechat, etc?

<+DJ> sure 11:04

<+Baxwill> ok, will.61107@gmail.com

thks

<+DJ> i'll check email in one hour 11:05

having firewood delivered at that time 11:06

dow has broken lower 11:07

<+szubaark> Buys ES @ 1259 «« paper »» 11:08

Exited all Long ES at 1259 --> 0 «« paper »» 11:09

<+DJ> that was quick

kn mentioned es going higher today

we are above Moving Avg line (200) 11:10

also, shorter MA line (20)

szu your buy was ok

bbl phone

<+szubaark> Buys ES @ 1261.25 «« paper »» 11:12

Exited all Long ES at 1261.25 --> 0 «« paper »»

<+startrader> Shorts NQ @ 1837 11:14

Shorts NQ @ 1838 -> Add 11:15

Long NQ @ 1838.75 -> Add 11:18

<KN-SR> 69 nxt! 11:19

<+DJ> ty

<+KN-SR> just a guess 11:20

:)

56.50 should the low for the rest of the day

<+DJ> ty

<+KN-SR> witing for 65.75 11:21

<+startrader> Shorts NQ @ 1838.75 -> Add 11:22

<+KN-SR> :)

<+DJ> for a short, kn?

or break up ward

<+KN-SR> no

to get out the 1205 trade with 1500 points

<+DJ> (ue)

<+KN-SR> and go for a long break

<+DJ> ok

<+KN-SR> i have to leave today so cannt wait for 75 11:23

<+DJ> awesome trade

<+KN-SR> thanks 11:24

<+startrader> Covered 1/2 NQ Short @ 1836 --> + 2.75 11:25

<JimL> why 1275 target?

<@X> #FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm

<+KN-SR> thats the strong res upward

but we will reach as high as 1292

sometime next week

i m leaving today , and wont be much infront of computer next week 11:26

<+DJ> have a good trip

<+KN-SR> i m clsoing the trade wtih 1500

will loose like 250 points 11:27

thanks DJ

will be hard to trade with a laptop

<+anglo> gl in whatever you do KN. 11:28

and thanks on behalf of us mere mortals at futurestrades chat room.

<+KN-SR> :) 11:29

u gyes are nice

as always

<+DJ> enjoy the trades here, kn 11:30

enjoying

<+KN-SR> :)

i will have a page open in the forum when i get back

i will try to post the s/r 11:31

<+DJ> grt

<+KN-SR> if that helps

<+DJ> (y)

<+JimL> that would be great KN, I really appreciate your insight & look to learn & help support the effort here 11:33

<+anglo> KN= Kewl & Nimble 11:34

<+KN-SR> thanks 11:36

and anglo.........nop

neither of those two......:) 11:37

<+anglo> humble too

KNH

<+KN-SR> hahah

what ever i do will go on plus side now. i guess 11:38

<nqcruiser> can u kick down DAX KN

<+KN-SR> hahaha 11:40

i m on long side right now

we had enough b...t kicked last week

and this week so far

<+DJ> this choppiness is frustrating for a swing trader 11:50

maybe a new lease: scalp instead

any opinions? 11:51

<+ItalianSharp> DJ, i actually can't see choppiness 11:52

what timeframe are you referring to?

NQ volatility flatlining, i expect a big move either way 11:53

<+JimL> summertime(vaca) & options fri not usually good for clear signals, big moves & little followthrough 11:54

<+startrader> Covered Remainder NQ Short @ 1836 --> + 1

<+rickf> back 11:59

<+JimL> each move this am has had large retracements & basically going sideways... 12:01

large = 50% or more 12:02

<+nqcruiser> i am havign a dog's breakfast on dax 12:18

<Awash> morning all 12:20

<+rickf> *yawn* 12:29

<+startrader> Long NQ @ 1825.25 12:30

<Nesi> Shorts ER2 @ 689.70 12:31

<+startrader> Long NQ @ 1824.25 -> Add

Exited 1/2 NQ Long @ 1828 --> + 3.75 12:45

<+rickf> short es 1255.75 12:51

1.25 ts

i need better sound effects for my platform lol 12:54

default alert when the stop moves is the same as when an order gets filled -- i keep thinking i placed an order every time the stop updates :)

exit 1/2 es 53.75 +2 12:55

out at 54.25 +1.5 12:56

short es 1254 13:03

late post

exit 1/2 es 1253 +1

exit remainder es 1253.25 +.75 13:04

<@X> #FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm 13:28

<+DJ> rick, nice trades, i was out 13:42

<+rickf> thx dj

thinking of calling it a day

this is like watching paint dry 13:43

<+DJ> yes(H)

<Awash> . 14:01

<+DJ> awash, thanks for your email... 14:05

<+rickf> only 1.5m es contracts moving thus far today ... think the weekend came early or something 14:09

<+Awash> DJ, anytime 14:15

looks like we have a rangebound day 14:21

<+szubaark> Buys ES @ 1256.75 «« paper »» 14:33

<+DJ> vol is so limited at this point 14:34

<+Awash> agree, not much participation this friday afternoon 14:35

Has anybody found this typical in the past?

<+rickf> summertime fridays 14:36

yeah it does happen

<+szubaark> Exited all Long ES at 1256.75 --> 0 «« paper »»

<+Awash> agree, pretty typical

<+DJ> my es signal trader did the same trade szu

in and out in two minute bars

chop 14:37

<+szubaark> No movement.. will mostly just watch

<+DJ> y

i'm a net loss today trading too much

fooling around

ridiculous

:-@ 14:38

<+Awash> DJ, just don't make it a habit of overtrading

it can be pretty costly

<+DJ> yes, it is weakness that I am tryin to overcome

I'll be ahead

<+szubaark> well, if u a newbie, Today should be difficult for you and its expected that u would be down (talkin from experience)

<+DJ> and then trade again

ty

I think I feel better:-( 14:39

<+Awash> DJ, how do you overcome that weakness? What measures do you take to make sure you don't do it in the future?

<+DJ> trying to inflict self control

<+Awash> just curious and trying to solicit conversation on this boring friday afternoon

<+DJ> I have to make rules for me

luckily today, very small sizing 14:40

and i was distracted by a delivery

of wood

live in snow country

so, that is not good

<+Awash> so you haven't made any rules but you know that you need too?

<+DJ> need to stick by and don't trade

in part

I have made rules and then I lose it

I get "greedy" or "confident" 14:41

i want confidence when I deserve it

<+Awash> understand

<+DJ> I had some good months

and then some real stinkers

i used strict rules in equity trades

so, that is my goal

get that "package of rules" and then execute 14:42

<+Awash> in trading, some things are easily said then done but you really have to live by your rules

<+DJ> yes, awash, by observing here, i will learn

i sure learned the hard way to have stops

I lost a connection once

and lost big

<+Awash> TRADING WITH STOPS IS A MUST IN THIS BUSINESS AT LEAST WITH INDEX FUTURES 14:43

<+DJ> caps for a reason

(y)

the catastrophic stop

that is a must

any time we could lose connection

I live in a rural area

with copper lines

no fiber here 14:44

<+Awash> On every trade you enter a STOP, right?

<+DJ> YES

right away

<+Awash> and profit target?

<+DJ> depends on price action but my drop dead is 2 to 3 points

I get out on signals

on the close side for profit

<+Awash> k

<+DJ> but, i truly am only 6 months old like a baby 14:45

(})

<+Awash> sounds good, as long as it makes you money, there are 1000's of ways to manage after an entry

really only 6 months?

<+DJ> I am not good enough yet

yes

but, 20 years trading equities and options

<+Awash> How did your simulation trading turn out?

<+DJ> it is not consistent yet 14:46

still tweaking all morning

it is customizable in many ways

i can reduce entries to just certain patterns

<+Awash> so you're not really throwing live capital at trading yet?

<+DJ> I did today

but lost a small bit

<+szubaark> Buys ES @ 1257.75 «« paper »»

<+DJ> one contract at a time 14:47

then adding as I see a run going

<+Awash> okay

<+DJ> then closing out completely on a break level

to close

it is so choppy today, and I also was away

that i missed a good trade

<+Awash> whatever happens just make sure you're solid on entry and exit rules and parameters in simulation (tweak everything before going live) 14:48

<+DJ> Yes, back to sim starting monday

more practice and tweaks

The 9am PST trade was my target on er 14:49

<+Awash> Never put live capital on trading until you're profitable in the sim first. Trading rules and setups have to be solid and you have to know them like you know 2 + 2 = 4 without even thinking twice or hestitating

<+DJ> that is good advice

ty

<+Awash> i burned my account twice before learning in 2003

<Widgetman> been there done that 14:50

<+Widgetman> sux

hehe

<+DJ> did you take a course?

<+Awash> Sucks very badly

No

<+Widgetman> yea

course of hard knocks in 2000

hehe

<+Awash> learned everything from people in here and on elitetrader.com

that sounds crazy but I did 14:51

<+DJ> is elitetrader a school on line?

<+szubaark> Exited all Long ES at 1256.25 --> - 1.5 «« paper »»

<+Awash> also stole some strategies from Szubaark, eminitrader, nihaba, jazz and other profitable traders in #FT

<+DJ> very good

I hope to learn here if poss

<+Awash> No, it's a personal trading website 14:52

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1256 «« paper »»

<+DJ> got it

<+Awash> www.elitetrader.com

<+DJ> vol spike on es szu

nice call 14:53

<+Widgetman> long 54.25

out +1

<+DJ> nice

quickie

<+Widgetman> spiked dn to MM line

4/8 mm

<+DJ> (y)

<+Awash> DJ, you can learn a lot here, just ask a lot of questions, especially about strategy and management and people here will be willing to share with you

<+DJ> that's great, awash 14:54

i hope to not be a burden here

i know there are others

who will learn with me

baxwill is very open to ideas

<+Awash> of course, that's the whole purpose of this room

<+DJ> I was hoping

it is lonely to lose money in my office 14:55

:-d

<+Awash> well, you're not going to lose any more money because you're going to consider my advice about sim trading before going live

so that problem is solved

<+DJ> yes!

that is exactly what is going to happen

<+Awash> sim trade until you're profitable, all you have to do is stick to the plan

<+DJ> sim only and then i will announce it here 14:56

when I got it

<+Awash> what kind of signals do you trade?

<+DJ> I am using a combo of Bollingers, vol, TS trades signals and

ranges

Pivots, and res/support levels

I am honing it

<+Awash> i don't mean indicators that you use to determine entry or exit 14:57

<+DJ> OH

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1254.25 --> + 1.75 «« paper »»

<+DJ> can you be more specific?

<+Awash> I mean, do you trade, Reversal setups, Pullback setups, or breakouts?

<+DJ> reversals

<+Awash> most trades are either one of the three

<+DJ> I get your drift

I like range reversals

I have lost in the middle of ranges

that is where my majority of errors have been in sim 14:58

and the few trades i have made

the other thing i have trouble with is

trading out too soon on the good trades

I lose my guts and get out

and then watch a trade go exactly as "planed" 14:59

it is tough

:planned:

<+Awash> okay, understood, do you trade pullbacks

<+DJ> I am not sure if I would know one if I saw one

I do look for ORBS 15:00

I traded 20 ORBS and made money

in march

<+Awash> okay, you definitely have to up your trading education that way you're able to know when price is rangebound, trending, consolidating, reversing, and/or pulling back 15:01

ORBS?

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Strategies
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Trading Strategies ->   Strategies used by NihabaAshi, from entry to exit, exploit inefficiencies in the price action for profits of the following trading instruments via WRB Analysis and Intermarket Analysis: Emini Index Futures (EMD, ER2, ES, NQ, YM), EuroFX Futures (EC), Eurex Index Derivatives (DAX, ESTX50), Euronext Index Futures (FTSE100, CAC40), Treasury Futures (ZF, ZN, ZB), NYMEX Energy Futures (CL, NG, HO, QM), COMEX Metals Futures (GC), Forex Currencies (EurUsd, EurYen, UsdCdn), Exchange Traded Funds (DIA, GLD, OIH, IWM, QQQQ, SPY, XLE) and Hang Seng Index Futures (HSI)

<+DJ> OK...that is good advice

opening range breakouts

<+Awash>

k

<+DJ> I have read Crabel's stuff

I know consolidations, and trends 15:02

rangebound almost indicates a consolidation

right?

but is breaking in wider range than a consolidation

<+Awash> yes,

<+DJ> ??

I draw trend lines 15:03

I also know how to spot formations

Head and Shoulders

I have studied that a lot

<+Awash> k

<+DJ> it was good for equities

not sure all of that is good other than to look at longer range charts

<+Awash> let's go back to your original comments about range reversal signals

<+DJ> OK

<+Awash> today is a rangebound day that would probably benefit your strategy 15:04

<+DJ> I got it

no big breakouts,right?

I can see the patterns

<+Awash> there are breakouts to new highs on my chart 15:05

<+DJ> let me open mind wider

i adjusted to 10 min chart for ref

I see the pop to 700 or so 15:06

<+Awash> sorry, let me pull up a ER, do you ever look at ES?

<+DJ> but a range from 687 and change to 697

yes

er is where I trade

but, I am now thinking es would be better here

more folks trading es

right? 15:07

I do see NQ's and some others and a couple of er traders

<+Awash> give me one second 15:08

<+DJ> awash, could you share how you trade?

<+Trader> Awash sorry but sim trading is not really the answer apart from learning the trading platform. Sim trading gived yo a false sense of security. 15:11

gived=gives 15:12

oy=you

<+DJ> is that because the money is not real, trader?

<+Trader> absolutely

<+DJ> false sense of security

well, I am a kick ass sim trader 15:13

and scare %%itless in reality

tell truth

<+Trader> you will see a big difference when you go live

<+DJ> man, it is scary

real $ on the line

<+szubaark> Shorts ES @ 1257.25 «« paper »»

<+DJ> but sim serves purpose

<+rickf> agree 100%

i went back live this past monday 15:14

<+DJ> sim serves or useless rick

<+Trader> also trading with smal amounts is not the answer unless you are trading for recreational puprposes

<+DJ> tiptoeing in

<+rickf> big difference trading live -- even w/1 or 2 contracts

<+Awash> I'm back, had an important phone call

<+DJ> Bush?

<+szubaark> rick, keep going

<+DJ> y

<+Awash> trader, i 15:15

<+rickf> szu - of course

<+Awash> i'm recommending the sim because it'll help DJ, with anything that he needs to tweak, for instance, execution strategy

<+DJ> szu, your trades look like my goal

<+szubaark> Covered all Short ES at 1256.25 --> + 1 «« paper »» 15:16

<+rickf> day like today i am VERY VERY hesitant to step in and trade -- in fact i was papertrading a few entries to tweak my platform.

<+DJ> nice

<+silo> Covered all ER2 Short @ 46545665165165 --> - 46545665164474.203 «« paper »»

<+rickf> nice profit silo :)

<+Awash> you can't possible try to learn to trade with live capital and not know when you're going to enter or exit or how you're going to play a certain scenario

<+silo> ahaha i realized i had a short in there lol

was a bit busy with some stuff earlier today

<+DJ> me 2

<+silo> so didn't pay attention to that paper trade hehe

<+rickf> awaassh - or know when to step aside because it's not a market you're 'good' or comfy trading in 15:17

<+Trader> rickf how do you know what kind of a day you are in if you don't trade real?

<+rickf> for me -- if you make a few bad trades and then stop, look at the tape to review your actions, and you realize the action is bad and not worth trading 15:18

<+Trader> I should have done that today

<+rickf> today, there was just a lot of range-bound chop that didn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling

<+Trader> wanted to get even

<+Awash> you can generally determine the type of day you're having based on the opening range, once the opening range has been set and each subsequent test of that range is hit and we come off of it, chances are we'll have a range day

<+Trader> lost all my profits for the last month

<+DJ> ok, grt

<+rickf> i would rather stop for the day with a loss than try 'vindication trades' 15:19

<+DJ> i have tried that, rick

vindication

<+rickf> we all do

<+DJ> screw-ication

badly

<+rickf> folks will lose on 2 contracts and be in the red

<+DJ> i once traded so many it was making me sweat

<+Awash> Trader, see last comments about range day

<+rickf> then they go in for 6 to make it up and lose even more

funny how we get cocky when we're behind, but very conservative with our winnings 15:20

<+DJ> i get angry

not good

<+rickf> that too

<+DJ> I have prayed in a sense once

<+Trader> you're 100% right rickf

<+DJ> PLEASE

that ended and I got out for a while

went back to options

<+Trader> but how do you cure this illness?

<+rickf> illness? 15:21

<+Trader> funny how we get cocky when we're behind, but very conservative with our winnings

<+DJ> wow,this price action on er is like opening 5 minutes in the morning

<+rickf> ah

chalk it up to human nature, i guess -- recognize it and STICK TO YOUR PLAN

<+DJ> yes

<+Trader> easier said than done

<+DJ> been too emotional

<+rickf> if you can only run 2 contracts, do not, NOT, NEVER play with 4 and 'hope' to catch up 15:22

etc etc

<+DJ> I read that elsewhere, rick

<+Trader> I would love to understand KN's entry method

<+DJ> I read one guy's plan to always stick with same size

<+szubaark> doesnt have IB adjusting Intraday Margins all the time, really can hurt the small guy

<+DJ> and to get out after a couple of bad trades

and have a glass of water

ME 2 15:23

KN has a knack

<+rickf> szu - do they change it INTRADAY or INTER-DAY

<+Trader> KN has a system. A knack or luck cannot explain what he does

<+szubaark> Intray.. think u need like over$10K per contract to feel safe now

<+rickf> sheesh 15:24

<+DJ> wow

didn't the sec make noise about higher margins? 15:25

just this week?

<+rickf> for commodities

<+DJ> OH

<+rickf> oil in particular

few weeks ago

<+DJ> I was wondering if it would affect these symbols

<+rickf> hope not :)

last 30 mins begins .... now 15:30

*cue spooky music*

<+silo> Long ER2 @ 693.40 -> large size «« paper »» 15:32

this is the one :)

<@X> #FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm 15:34

<+silo> come on... it needs to really breakout side of this area

<+DJ> my signals show a stall 15:37

could be late day

but, then again???

<+rickf> heavy resistane at around 1259 ES

<+DJ> not enough vol? 15:40

<+silo> Long ER2 @ 694 -> Add «« paper »»

<+rickf> long es 1258.75 sm sz

1 only

59.75 sorry 15:42

exit es 1259 -.75 15:43

<+Nesi> Shorts ER2 @ 693.00 15:44

* +rickf thought we almost punched thru there

<+szubaark> not enough volume...they could finish the week here

<+rickf> yep - is why i ran only 1 contract with 1pt stop; pure speculative 15:45

<+DJ> when someone sells, someone buys

<+rickf> i knew i was missing something... 15:46

<+DJ> ha

<+rickf> :)

<+DJ> vol has picked up a bit

693.4 is vwap 15:49

c u next week, thanks for the input everyone 15:50

<+rickf> me too.....boring day, have a good weekend all

<+silo> Exited all ER2 Long @ 693.60 --> - 0.2 «« paper »» 15:56

* starglazer - [ is away ] [ Reason: Activate IdleAway: 300 min ] [ Time: 13:06:45 ] [ Pager: on ] [ Log: on ] 16:07

<+Awash> later all 16:16

good night

<@X> #FuturesTrades Info -> No gurus, no head traders. Members use this room to document (trade journal) their trades and thoughts from one trade to the next trade because it provides critical information they can't get from broker statements nor statistics. Also, mimicking the trades by others is not recommended without their permission. More info at www.thestrategylab.com/FuturesTradesChat Room.htm 17:37

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Argentina, Australia, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, Denmark, France, Germany, Greece, Hong Kong (China), Israel, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Portugal, Puerto Rico (U.S.), Saudi Arabia, Singapore, Spain, United States and Venezuela.

In addition, below are the trading instruments our chat room members monitor closely to make trade decisions:

CME Emini Futures EMD, ER2, ES and NQ

CBOT mini-sized Dow Futures YM

Eurex Index Derivatives (futures) DAX and DJ Euro Stoxx50

Eurex Fixed Income Derivatives BUND, BOBL and Schatz

Euronext Futures FTSE-100 and CAC-40

CME Futures EuroFX EC

Treasury Futures T-Notes ZN, ZF and T-Bonds ZB

Forex Currencies EurUsd, EurYen and UsdCdn

Exchange Traded Funds DIA, IWM, QQQQ, SPY, OIH, XLE and GLD

NYMEX Energies Light Crude Oil CL, e-miNY QM and Natural Gas NG

COMEX Metals Gold GC and ZG

Hang Seng Index Futures HSI

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